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標題: HST 係唔係冇好處? [打印本頁]

作者: sheep 時間: 2011-4-23 20:28 標題: HST 係唔係冇好處?

利多於弊？
扼殺中小企?

作者: Lik 時間: 2011-4-23 20:51

My understanding is that it is an extremely beneficial move to the businesses, regardless of whether it is big or small. First, they have to file one less tax claim form. Second, they also collect a bigger tax rebate on their supplies and stuff.

The biggest problem with voting down the HST on referendum is that the province will have to re-pay the federal government for the huge federal subsidy / transfer funds that the province received. The province has already spent a huge chunk of that federal subsidy, so it'd be hard to cough up that money again. Ultimately, that bill will fall back on our shoulders as residents of the province.

Of course, not voting against the HST means we'll have to eat a lot of the extra costs when we shop now. IIRC, some of the provincial politicians have tossed out the idea of reducing the HST percentage by 1%, but I am fairly certain that the federal government has already mentioned that under the agreement with the province, the HST percentage cannot be changed for something like at least 2+ years (I forgot the exact number).

So it is really a bit of a dilemma...

-Lik

作者: peter236 時間: 2011-4-23 20:58

For restaurants, it is bad. Clearly, both western and Chinese restaurants have witnessed declining sales. It is easier to book tables and restaurants are less crowded.

作者: Look4chrisng 時間: 2011-4-23 21:22

HST is supposed to be good for Businesses, and business will be more profitable and pass on the saving to customers. Saving will be trickle down.

But you have to be in the trickle down will actually happen.

作者: Prelude 時間: 2011-4-23 21:50

HST has good motive but at the bad time, because it hurts spending in a slow economy.
HST is good for big companies, because they will have bigger cash flow before the submit to Government, and that cash flow can do lots of stuff and make money.
HST doesn't do any good for small companies or restaurants, because the collected HST is not big enough to make any investment before submit to Government.

At the current situation, I rather stick with HST now, because
1).  Our lovely campbell spent the federal incentives already, we are too poor to payback.
2).  Our lovely campbell spent millions on marketing the HST, and if we reverse it, then that means all those marketing just went down the drain and no use at all.
3).  People are getting used to it already, and we already took the major hit of low spending at the beginning.  If we reverse it now, then that major hit was taken for nothing.

The point is, to keep the hst or not, still hurts us at the current situation.  But since we suffered half of the disadvantage already, we might as well suffer of the remaining half to gain the benefit of HST in the future.

作者: somewhereintime 時間: 2011-4-23 22:05

Very unique viewpoint,
I tend to agree

作者: Lik 時間: 2011-4-23 22:33

2). Our lovely campbell spent millions on marketing the HST, and if we reverse it, then that means all those marketing just went down the drain and no use at all.

The point is, to keep the hst or not, still hurts us at the current situation
Prelude 發表於 2011-4-23 21:50

The HST marketing campaign that Campbell did is money that has already been spent. Regardless of whether we keep or scrap the HST, that money is down the drain and gone for good. As such, it should have no longer have any bearing on the consideration to keep or scrap the HST in the upcoming referendum.

The pragmatic thing to do is to vote in the referendum based on whether keeping or rejecting the HST will hurt us more. On this front alone, I'd say the pragmatic approach is to grudgingly keep it. On the other hand, the idealistic approach is that the Campbell government sneaked this one up on us despite their promise to not introduce something like this. As such, we need to vote no to send them a clear message.

Again, neither choice is optimal, but we gotta choose the less rotten one between the two.

-Lik

作者: satil 時間: 2011-4-23 23:05

every1 forgot we r not the first Prov has HST.. it is FAR from Liberal gov.
HST has long term adv.
i support HST.
but.. they inc the tax base!!!!
y not -1%
y not -2%.. make it 10%... easy calculate.. $123.45.. tax $12.345
every1 happy.

作者: rainbow-davie 時間: 2011-4-24 02:52

Actually, I don't mind about HST ONLY if its rate is lower. like 5%.. not 13%.
and I don't like the way the gov't try to pass this law.

作者: sheep 時間: 2011-4-24 07:03

回復 8# satil

不過 NDP 話溫哥華南啲做生意嘅
唔鐘意呢個稅
你做生意嘅
點解唔反對
你做好大生意？

作者: somewhereintime 時間: 2011-4-24 07:17

Nobody like paying tax, but the gov't cannot operate without tax money.
Some small biz pocket the HST tax collected and file for tax return,
it is honour system.
The Chinese restaurants I go are so busy, they do better sales than last year,
customers would pay up to $2,500 a table for lunch
Dynasty and Shiang Garden,, and some restaurant move 30 King Crabs a day.
There is a mega Chinese restaurant in the planning, CAD 30 millions investment
70,000 sq ft.
Check out how busy the Chinese restaurant are tomorrow, however, the Western
restaurants will be slow or even close due to Easter

作者: jennychick 時間: 2011-4-24 07:46

I don't like the way the gov't try to pass this law.

作者: sheep 時間: 2011-4-24 08:01

睇來
呢個稅都壞唔哂
不過就係推銷手法欠妥
又有咩補救方法呢

作者: blue20ae 時間: 2011-4-24 08:35

I dont know why the Chinese restaurants are saying HST is slowing them down. Everything I want a table it is always a long wait.

作者: satil 時間: 2011-4-24 09:32

it is not HST slow them down.
it is the RAISE of price. e.g. 6 month ago a $5.95 lunch now may be $7.95 (33%)
i know food cost raise a lot. (15%-45%)
for HST.. every $10 you spend, only $0.7 more. (7%)
which affect more !!!!

作者: satil 時間: 2011-4-24 09:43

回復 10# sheep

本人未退休前以大股東身份運作6間小型公司.
現退休後以小股東身份擁有9間小中大公司 (只參與大事會議, 不做日常運作決策).

十分贊成hst, 長遠對工商業更方便, 但自由黨的手法有問題, 擴大稅基, 好應減低稅率. 例如10%
或遲些才擴大稅基, 不應用時.

等一年後, 如果政府要多0的, 或加多1%, 想信無人會反對.

作者: somewhereintime 時間: 2011-4-24 13:02

回復 14# blue20ae

Chinese like to gather and eat at holidays

作者: Prelude 時間: 2011-4-24 14:45

Of course the HST has its advantage.
1.) Much easier to calculate.
2.) Less confusion = increase spending (only little effects though)
3.) Reduce government staff
4.) Attract big companies = more jobs = more spending

Disadvantages:
1.) Increase total price of spending.  7% increase affects much more than 7% decrease in spending, because people's demand/price ratio is not linear.
2.) Chinese restaurant pockets more tax money.
3.) On the edge of closing restaurants see this as a final blow, along with all the "anti-restaurants" policies/law in this 4 years.
4.) Crazy inflation + increase tax is not good combination.

Again, long term effects is good, but it's the timing that's not good.
Some say the way Campbell put it down our throat is bad, but no one likes taxes.  If they ask for our opinion before adding tax, do you think it will ever go through?  Never will.

I would say the best way to handle this is reduce it by 1% or 2%, people will love it.  But I heard that part of the deal from federal government is that the rate can't be changed within 1 year, not sure it's true or not.

作者: rainbow-davie 時間: 2011-4-24 15:31

Also, there is conceptual question, which is, the argument is that business will save money by HST thus the extra money will go to workers. Is that true? will it be true? I doubt.

作者: Prelude 時間: 2011-4-24 17:42

Also, there is conceptual question, which is, the argument is that business will save money by HST t ...
rainbow-davie 發表於 2011-4-24 15:31

Well, this question is same as "Will you be richer if Donald Trump just made $10 million today?".

作者: somewhereintime 時間: 2011-4-24 17:55

回復 18# Prelude

According to  Layton, we have the option of eliminating HST without coughing it out.
IFF  Layton has his way, one way or the other
That is:  1. He became the PM and the NDP rules Canada for the next 4 years
               2. He became the  Leader of the coalition gov't                3. In the case of another minority government, he can blackmail the gov't to push that policy

So say hi to lucky Layton, the king-maker

作者: peter236 時間: 2011-4-24 18:21

Nobody like paying tax, but the gov't cannot operate without tax money.
Some small biz pocket the H ...
somewhereintime 發表於 2011-4-24 07:17

Where is this new mega Chinese restaurant?

作者: Lik 時間: 2011-4-24 19:14

So say hi to lucky Layton, the king-maker
somewhereintime 發表於 2011-4-24 17:55

In the last 2 governments, Layton has played the King-maker role to its maximum potential. But now that the NDP's support is slightly higher than the Liberals', it makes me wonder if he can continue to play this opportunistic role.

As the official Opposition party, you can't just rely on landing the same old cheap shots when the opponent is looking the other way.

-Lik

作者: hscac 時間: 2011-5-20 00:07

HST has good motive but at the bad time, because it hurts spending in a slow economy.
HST is good fo ...
Prelude 發表於 2011-4-23 21:50

" The point is, to keep the hst or not, still hurts us at the current situation. But since we suffered half of the disadvantage already, we might as well suffer of the remaining half to gain the benefit of HST in the future."

I agree with your point.

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