Ultraman

原帖由 mcjohnjohn 於 2009-1-6 21:29 發表


Would it be greedy if I want to earn more money from job as I am trying to steal money from my boss?
Your world is definitely different from mine.

It's not my unique point of view, please triple check with your bible and pastor, is "greedy" a good thing, or not count as a "problem" from your God's POV? Most people will admit, any kind of gambling means a person bets a relatively smaller portion of money (or material) in order to get a relatively bigger portion back in return. The idea is not "what you get is what you work for" but you're getting (or a chance to) more than what you should get, that means "greedy". To work harder at work in order to get more pay, it is "hard working" or "ambitious", but not greedy.
Many people know greedy is absolutely not a good thing in Christianity and Catholics. To say my POV is different from yours, better say your POV is different from your religion and many other believers.

Ultraman

原帖由 mcjohnjohn 於 2009-1-6 21:12 發表


Where in bible say believers is not eligible to play mahjong and buy mark 6?
Can you please point it out clearly?

Seems that you are the one who don't see your problem.

Where in the bible says kids shouldn't play PS3, xbox360, Wii and DS 8 hours a day instead of doing their homework?
OK now I understand, you just follow exactly what the bible says words by words, instead of to understand the true meaning of it.

Ultraman

原帖由 shutterbug 於 2009-1-6 21:42 發表

As I've said before, playing MJ in a church is not a good idea because it makes people who don't know think that they're gambling.  Nobody wants this extra trouble and confusion.  When people see MJ, they automatically think it's gambling.  Plus, why do you have to play it in church, there are many other games!  I don't even play cards there.  One should know what's appropriate and what's not.  To do something not that beneficial but may cause harm, it's better not to do it at all or seek alternative.

In HK, soccer used to be a very healthy sport game until soccer gambling is legalized. From then on, soccer is (could be) a gambling tool too. So, is playing soccer OK in church? Would there be people think it's a gambling game?
I know, MJ has been widely spread as a gambling game for centuries. It's very normal for people to have an impression that playing MJ means gambling automatically. However, does it mean that believers need not to explain/clarify to others if they just want to play it as an entertainment but not gambling at all? Actually MJ is a very good tool for brain exercise, and good for Parkinson patients and lots more benefits (without money involved).

As for 649, thank God that I've never bought it in my Christian life so you know what's my view.  For a church to accept money donation originated from 649 is a risk and kind of inappropriate, just like the MJ case.  Likewise, do you think a church will accept money originated from a robbery?  There are many people who don't know what's going on and what those people going to say could harm the church's image.

Yes, I think like that too. But it's mcjohnjohn who thinks it's not a problem, more than OK for a church to accept these kind of money (not me). Tell him/her what others think la.

Ultraman

mcjohnjohn, I'm glad that you're "back to what you are before". Haha...
I always treasure our open discussion.
I didn't mean to challenge you or disrespect you, I just want to be a mirror of you, to reflect what you can't see about yourself. (please excuse me if I'm over-ranked myself)
What I want to point out is, yes, every human is not perfect, including believers and non-believers. You can be greedy even you are a believer, and I can be selfish even I become a believer too (for example). So what?! I just dislike people "tell lies with their eyes widely opened". You can be greedy and gamble even you're a believer, but gotta know your mighty God is not happy about it. That's it.

Ultraman

Can you please kindly explain the true meaning of the bible? I am glad to get some ideas from you.
Yes, my POV is different from many other believers. Should believer have the same POV in all aspect?
If two person have totally same POV as each other, they are clone.

For example, bible didn't say kids can't play PS3, xbox360.... 8 hours a day and not doing their homework. Of course, there were no such things at that time, so you won't see those items in the bible. However, there are many "ideas"/"concepts" clearly stated, such as "people should not do anything that is harmful to their bodies (health)", this implies playing video games in an addicted way is a no no in God's eyes.
And therefore, there are a lot of things didn't mention in the bible words by words like that, so people have to interpret every single sentence by their own understanding and judgment, and thus different "meanings" come up. What is real truth and what isn't, only God knows. But what is more likely and what is more unlikely, "mature believers" should have a closer compromised answer.

Ultraman

原帖由 mcjohnjohn 於 2009-1-7 05:28 發表


"people should not do anything that is harmful to their bodies (health)"..
咁係唔係唔應該BBQ, 因為食得多BBQ燶左既食物係會致癌? 定係唔好燒咁燶? 但係唔夠耐又未必熟, 又會有蟲, 影響身體woh.
I agree  ...

See?! There are a lot of things didn't tell words by words from the bible, and people have to decide what can do and what can't do (as I mentioned). Is it a "problem" for Christians/Catholics smoke, watch AV, clubbing, drink alcohol, not lending money to others, not donate money to charities in different religious background.... ? Every believer could have different view, and so many people think of this, another reason why they don't want to believe these religions.

Ultraman

原帖由 mcjohnjohn 於 2009-1-7 05:36 發表


Ultraman, I am always myself. It is always good to have some discussion and it makes LYK more exposure.
How can you know my God would not be happy to my MJ and Mark-6? Are you God? hehehe
If someone would donate 50% of the prize when he/she win the lucky draw, I really don't think that God would be sad.

You said you hate people "tell lies with their eyes widely opened", in my opinion, as I always try to believe ALL things that you guys tell me. I am quite honest, so I think that you guys are as honest as me.

In your POV, whether Christians/Catholics can gamble or not could be debating, but my POV is it is clearly stated in the bible. You should ask more believers' opinion. However, since it is not written like that words by words, people could have different understanding anyways. You'll know one day you meet your God.

As another lyk (SB) put up an example, how if a robbery donate money to a church, would God be appreciated? I'm sure you think that God will be happy too.

Ultraman

原帖由 shutterbug 於 2009-1-7 08:13 發表

I don't want to be off topic too far, but I'll answer this one.  Soccer so far is still not considered as a gambling game yet.  Plus the gambling happens externally for the most part.  People gamble on many things, do those all need to be reconsider for the church?  I don't think so...it's case by case...what's the history of gambling in MJ compared to soccer?  You can answer this one yourself.

What is a "gambling tool" and what isn't? What ever a tool is being used for gambling, it is a gambling tool (at that moment). That's why I said playing chess could be too (even PS3, xbox....). But if money (or any other "material") is not involved, those tools are not for gambling, and so they ain't gambling tool. Why quote a fixed title to them? Doesn't this kind of attitude fits into the topics' 8 categories?

Ultraman

原帖由 shutterbug 於 2009-1-7 13:05 發表

Nonetheless the basis for salvation should be the same.  How does that stop anyone from believing?

Using the previous example BBQ, even a non-believer knows eating BBQ frequently is not healthy.  If ...

I think I (not a believer) have a clearer concept than mj, he/she should read your comment sincerely.

Ultraman

原帖由 shutterbug 於 2009-1-7 13:09 發表

I agree on this wor.  But for the sake of non believers and not to give a bad image, playing MJ in a church is not recommended.  Ask some other people how they feel if they see Christians playing MJ  ...

Christians see a prostitute falls down on the ground, and in order to avoid non-believers' confusion and avoid to give bad image, they shouldn't go give her a hand and help her up?