中國大陸：20多城市紛興建 全國地鐵多虧損 大城市, 北京, 上海, 香港, 南京

Lik

http://news.mingpao.com/20110105/cab2.htm

20多城市紛興建 全國地鐵多虧損

【明報專訊】除高鐵外，內地城市也出現「地鐵大躍進」。除仍在擴建的北京、上海、天津、廣州、深圳、南京地鐵外，還有20多個城市正在興建地鐵，但調查顯示，全國地鐵幾乎都處於虧損狀態。有學者認為，香港地鐵盈利模式難以在內地複製。

營運不善 納稅人埋單

目前正在興建地鐵的城市還有瀋陽、青島、杭州、無錫、成都、昆明等。中央人民廣播電台稱，除大城市外，一些中型城市也紛紛申建地鐵，但報道引述一項調查顯示，除上海地鐵1號線在開通9年後才實現真正盈利外，其他地鐵都處於虧損狀態。

對於內地的「地鐵大躍進」，中國人民大學教授張鳴認為，如果地鐵建成後客流量不大或營運不善，最終埋單的還是納稅人。但中國工程院院士王夢恕則認為，修建地鐵確能夠緩解日益嚴重的城市交通堵塞問題。

港鐵模式難複製

內地時政評論員江德斌指出，香港地鐵是依靠沿線物業開創出「地鐵+房地產」的模式，而且香港人多地窄、市民收入高、地鐵客量穩定，票價亦是亞洲之最，這些是香港地鐵成功的因素，內地具備的城市非常之少。

Lik

1.  初頭你就話唔使起，因大陸人口密度唔夠。
2.  依家被我反駁哂你d謬論,又轉移話題話貪官起喺郊區泥順便起樓掠水。
      即係你自己都默認應該起！
fy789 發表於 2011-1-5 16:11

契弟，你唔好成日要我當眾咁落你面好唔好？我做都做到厭喇...

人口密度高嘅舊區，一係就地鐵去唔到。一係已經老早起好，但站太細、人太多，變咗服務同人流比例失衡。而且舊嘅地鐵網絡同地上嘅發展失咗配合，搞到有站嘅地方唔響人流區，但人流區附近就無站。亦即係話，擔地鐵去人流區一係就要行餐死，一係就要出咗地鐵站之後再搭的士。試吓你要去尖東，但最近嘅站只係得旺角，睇吓你又會點？北京地鐵好多站就正正係如此。唔記得廣州定係琛圳亦有同樣嘅問題。

人地倫敦就唔同，舊站舊線路有之餘，新站、新線路亦不斷係咁起。而其中新站、新線路有好多時候有會駁返啲舊站，另到地鐵嘅網絡四通八達，而舊站亦會不斷擴建。雖然咁樣有時候會令到乘客要落多幾層，但服務同人流嘅比例就好好多。

好啦，你響大陸起新線喇，但係就起埋響啲人口物度低嘅地區。美其名就話係連埋地產發展項目來帶旺該區，實際上就係等你啲權貴有工程接，可以從中抽水搵着數。

呢幾樣野，我睇唔到有乜野係 contradictory，更睇唔到我幾時話啲低密度嘅地區應該起 mass transit。

你個低能兒自己有病同有理解能力障礙就唔該你收聲，咪成日徙我時間。

-力

Ovaltine

huh? corruption is beneficial to society? do you mean triad society?
mcjohnjohn 發表於 2011-1-5 17:34

heres a quote from arguebly the most influential intellect living today

My view, for what it's worth, is that Kennedy was probably the most dangerous president we've had. [applause] There was a really dangerous, macho streak there, which was kind of fanatic. A lot of it is coming out now in the coverage of the Cuban Missile Crisis, which is quite revealing. It looks even worse than it looked before. And an awful lot of this willingness to drive the world to total destruction looks like a matter of protecting your macho image. Now, that kind of stuff is really dangerous. It's much better -- the best political leaders are the ones who are lazy and corrupt. It's the ones who are after power - they are the dangerous ones. So the guys who want to watch television and sleep and so on, they are no big problem. I should say the same about corruption. Corruption is a very positive sign of government. You should always be in favor of corruption. If people are interested in enriching themselves or in sex or something like that, then they are not interested in power. And the most dangerous thing is the guys that want power. That's what Kennedy was like, I think. Furthermore, corruption has a way of being exposed for quite simple reasons. When people are corrupt, they are usually robbing other rich people. Therefore they are going to block people and when corruption gets exposed it weakens power. And so that's one of the ways you can defend yourself. The same is true of the evangelicals. If we had evangelicals who were really after power, we'd be in trouble. If all they want is gold Cadillacs and sex and so on, no big problem. That's good.

    * Talk titled "Necessary Illusions" at MIT, May 10, 1989 Noam Chomsky

I don't feel the need for senseless bashing of the PRC government, there are enough negative things about them already. But building subway is definitely not one of them, this is a positive investment for the future. As for corruption, I wouldn't worry so much. The problem of China lies upon inequality amongs its people, we need to focus on human rights, access of education for the less fortunate, free health etc etc.

peter236

你廢up之前唔該就做返多少功課啦。響大陸啲地鐵，發展係一路向低密度嘅地區連同地產項目一切發展，等啲權貴 ...
Lik 發表於 2011-1-5 14:27

Do you have claim to what you said? Are you an expert of subway routes in Chinese cities? From what I can see in Shanghai they have 20 million people there, and the city has high population density throughout the city, and therefore their subway serve all the high density areas.

Also, cities like Suzhou, Ningbo, Hangzhou,  all have millions of people each, and they together with Shanghai are forming a big metropolis with continuous high population density.

In south China, cities like Guangzhou, Foshan, Dongguan, and Shenzhen each have millions of people, and together they have nearly 30 million people and they are forming another big metropolis region with continuous high population density. Therefore, their subway serve all the high density areas.

Similar situation with Beijing, and Tianjin in the Bohai region.

mcjohnjohn

actually, noam chomsky said corruption is beneficial to society, i yet have the intellect to figure  ...
Ovaltine 發表於 2011-1-6 09:31

huh? corruption is beneficial to society? do you mean triad society?

Ovaltine

actually, noam chomsky said corruption is beneficial to society, i yet have the intellect to figure this out.

mcjohnjohn

回復  Lik

力力，
點解今次唔引述有關你所講嘅野嘅負面新聞報導呢？ 定係跟本
無證據？

1.  初頭你就話 ...
fy789 發表於 2011-1-6 08:11

力兄根本就係覺得d 貪官抽水... 如果冇貪官抽水, 佢就冇野好講了.
可恨既係大陸抽水事件既發生機會真的好像比較高.

mcjohnjohn

一個話連 London 同 New York 嘅人口物度都話低嘅低能兒，我真係O晒嘴，唔知仲有咩可以同佢講。

-力 ...
Lik 發表於 2011-1-6 05:11

國內有好多城市人口密度應該都好高. 小弟只去過北京同廣州, 我覺得同旺角銅鑼灣既人流有得揮! 搞到我心郁郁想o係當地買幾個鋪位收租! (可惜冇銀兩)